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Production phase (confirmed)

 
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horacechan1



Joined: Jan 21, 2017
Posts: 14

PostPosted: Mon Mar 06, 2017 2:57 pm    Post subject: Production phase (confirmed) Reply with quote

In the game 64162,
The production phase in the program is money ->grain-> stone-> book
However, I remember the rulebook say I can product all first before paying anything
So, now I need to pay resource for lack of food, I want to pay stone but the program force me to pay money.

If it is possible, can you maunally add $1 and minus 1 stone for me?

And also, shall the program changed the code for this purpose?
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MaBi
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Joined: Jan 01, 2006
Posts: 925
Location: Italy

PostPosted: Mon Mar 06, 2017 3:45 pm    Post subject: Re: Production phase Reply with quote

horacechan1 wrote:
In the game 64162,
The production phase in the program is money ->grain-> stone-> book
However, I remember the rulebook say I can product all first before paying anything

Hmm... no, rulebook says you produce a resource before consuming it, so if you have for example a military upkeep in gold you can pay it with the gold just produced. But the rulebook explicitely states the order of production: "Calculate production and consumption for each resource in the order shown on the player aid cards (Gold, Food, Stone, Books). Sum up your total production and consumption of each resource..."
The way I interpret this, current implementation seems correct to me.
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horacechan1



Joined: Jan 21, 2017
Posts: 14

PostPosted: Mon Mar 06, 2017 4:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

So if I produce stone first, and I lack of food and book
I can paid the extra resource for either stone or money
Am I right?
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MaBi
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Joined: Jan 01, 2006
Posts: 925
Location: Italy

PostPosted: Mon Mar 06, 2017 4:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You first produce Gold: if your total (all Gold production minus all Gold consumption) is positive then you get Gold otherwise you lose it, and if you haven't enough Gold to pay then you lose 1 VP and pay in Books (and if you don't have Books you pay in whatever else you have at the moment).
Then you produce Food, and the same is repeated: if your total is negative you must pay in Food, then Books, then whatever you have (including the Gold produced in the step above, if any).
Then you produce Stone and apply the same logic.
And finally you produce Books, always in the same way.
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BlixLT



Joined: Jan 21, 2017
Posts: 6

PostPosted: Tue Apr 23, 2019 7:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Is this an official ruling? We had a similar situation in the 74334 game and H__B lost 1 vp due to not having enough books to pay for a lack of stone. (Although he produced books during that production phase).

I wonder what does this sentence means in the faq: (Resources are produced before they are consumed). My interpretation till now was that all resources are produced before all resources are consumed. Or does it mean something else?
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BlixLT



Joined: Jan 21, 2017
Posts: 6

PostPosted: Tue Apr 23, 2019 8:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The more I look into it, the more confused I get. Some bgg forums cite rules, some - faq (saying that all production comes before all consumption).
Still looking into this (https://boardgamegeek.com/thread/1088563/production-order) it seems to me that all production is done before all consumption. Some users stated that and then Rustan (the game designer) did not correct them, so the statement ("The Official FAQ states (on the 1st page), that production goes before consumption, so I think that the production order doesn't matter in any case.") must be right.
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BlixLT



Joined: Jan 21, 2017
Posts: 6

PostPosted: Tue Apr 23, 2019 3:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I got a confirmation from Rustan in the mentioned game forum (https://boardgamegeek.com/thread/1088563/production-order), so it is actually a bug here - all production happens before all consumption (but not how it is implemented now - each resource's production/consumption in some order).

Unless I am missing something, but it looks like that was what happened in the mentioned game - 74334.
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MaBi
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Joined: Jan 01, 2006
Posts: 925
Location: Italy

PostPosted: Wed Apr 24, 2019 8:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sigh... not good having this clarification after so much time, not good at all. I stopped Nations development a long time ago and this is not a simple one-line bugfix but a serious change requiring a lot of time for testing. I will have a look but I don't know if I will be able to change this.
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